1. God knows all things, including those who will be saved (THE ELECT). 2. God’s foreknowledge does not destroy, but includes, free will. 3. God desires all men to be saved. 4. Jesus died to redeem all men. 5. God provides sufficient grace for all men to be saved. 6. Man, in the exercise of his free will, can accept or reject grace. 7. Those who accept grace are saved, or born-again. 8. Those who are born-again can fall away or fall into sin. 9. Not everyone who is saved will persevere in grace. 10. Those who do persevere are God’s elect. 11. Those who do not persevere, or who never accepted grace, are the reprobate. 12. Since we can always reject God in this life, we have no absolute assurance that we will persevere. 13. We can have a moral assurance of salvation if we maintain faith and keep God’s commandments (1 John 2:1-6; 3:19-23; 5:1-3,13).

IMPORTANT DISTINCTIONS

1. Predestination is not predetermination :

“Predestination is nothing else than the foreknowledge and foreordaining of those gracious gifts which make certain the salvation of all who are saved.” (St. Augustine, Persever 14:35)

Predestination is God’s decree of the happiness of the elect. God’s infallible foreknowledge (and thus predestination also) includes free will. God’s foreknowledge cannot force upon man unavoidable coercion, for the simple reason that it is at bottom nothing else than the eternal vision of the future historical actuality. God foresees the free activity of a man precisely as that individual is willing to shape it, predestination is not predetermination of the human will.

2. Election is a consequence of God’s foreknowledge :

By definition, the ELECT are those whom God infallibly foresees will be saved (Rom 8:28-30). By this definition, it is impossible for the elect to be lost, precisely because God foreknows who will not be lost. But since election depends on God’s infallible foreknowledge, we simply have no way of knowing whether or not we are in that category — God knows with certainty His elect, but we do not. The elect are predestined in the sense that God knows them, and enables them by grace, to be saved.

3. Free will can resist and reject God’s grace :

“You stiff-necked people…you always resist the Holy Spirit” (Acts 7:51). The angels possessed grace and perfectly intact intellect, and yet many of them freely sinned and rejected God. Adam and Eve possessed grace and a perfectly intact nature, and yet they freely sinned. How much more so is it possible for the born-again Christian, who possesses grace but also a wounded nature and a darkened intellect, to sin also. Paul mentions sins which keep a man from the Kingdom of God: fornication, adultery, homosexuality, theft, greed, and so on (1 Cor 6:9-10).

When Jesus was expressly asked what one must do to gain eternal life, he answered, “keep the commandments,” and went on to list the moral commandments of the Decalogue (Matt 19:16-21). Revelation describes those whose lot is the burning pool of fire and sulfur, the second death: “cowards, the unfaithful, the depraved, murderers, the unchaste” and so on (Rev 21:8). Aren’t born-again Christians capable of these sins? And if they die in these sins, how can they possibly inherit heaven? If Adam and Eve could fall from grace, surely we can fall from grace as well. Surely we can harden our hearts and resist the Holy Spirit.

4. We cannot confuse Election with being “Born Again” :

The set of those who are “born again” (in Catholic and historic Christian understanding those who have been regenerated “of water and Spirit” in the Sacrament of Baptism — John 3:3,5; Acts 2:38) is not necessarily co-extensive with the set of those who will persevere and gain eternal life. Born-again Christians can and (sadly) do fall away. Otherwise free will and (mortal) sin are merely fictitious for a Christian during this life of testing and pilgrimage. Otherwise all the language in Scripture of persevering to the end in order to be saved (cf. Matt 10:22; 24:13; Phil 2:12-13) makes no sense.
MICKY – http://micky-clontarf.blogspot.com/

I, MICKY, AM A GIFT TO ALL PEOPLE.

The burden of proof is on you to demonstrate that God only foreknows, predestines, elects, etc. only after we demonstrate a saving faith. That totally turns Romans 8 & 9 upside down, especially since in Romans 9:11, 9:16, 9:18 it states that election unto salvation is based on God’s actions!

Eternal destiny? Does not God work all things according to the council of His will? Eph. 1:11. Was not His election, predestination, adoption made in eternity past, before the foundation of this world? Eph.1:4,5. God is immutable, unchanging. If He decreed that you and I be among the saved, are you saying that your will to rebel is greater than His will to determine your salvation? What is simpler than God being sovereign and us not?

2Pet. 3:9, “… patient toward you…” who is the “you” that Peter wishes they not perish? In verse 9, the subject of the sentence is “you”, in verse 8 the subject is “beloved”. In verse 1 of chapter 3, Peter tells us that this is his second letter to the beloved. In 1 Peter 1:1, Pete is addressing this letter to the elect, which means that his second letter was also addressed to the elect which means that the “beloved” of 2 Peter 3 are the elect, which means that the “all” of verse 9 are the elect. This passage only proves my position of God only wanting His elect to be saved and not every individual.

Matthew 23:37 is about Jesus rebuking the Jewish elders who DID NOT gather the children together as a hen gathers her chicks. Who was it that killed the prophets and stoned those whom God sent?

Those statements sound to me like the ball’s in our court.

Ephesians 2 & 3 do not support your view of God wanting to save every Jew and every Gentile, only that he came to save His people from both the Jews and Gentiles

You are right that none of us can do the calling, predestinating, foreknowing, justifying, or glorifying. Only God can do those things. But I believe his word teaches that he will only do those things when we’ve done the things he’s told us to do. Believing, confessing, repenting, being baptized, striving to serve God faithfully… those are all things that we can (and must) do.

That’s why it’s hard for me to see the passages concerning predestination as having to do with individuals being locked into an eternal destiny regardless of their beliefs or actions. I just don’t see how that concept fits with the simpler teachings of the bible.

I also disagree with your last statement. 2 Peter 3 seems to be saying that God has not brought the judgment sooner because he wants all men to take advantage of the extra time and turn to him before it’s too late. Matthew 23:37 seems to make the statement that Christ earnestly desired for the Jews to serve God faithfully, but they weren’t willing. Those statements sound to me like the ball’s in our court. And Ephesians 2:14-18 says that Christ abolished the Old Law so that both Jews and Gentiles could be saved — and everyone falls into one of those two groups. And Ephesians 3 tells us that it was God’s plan from the beginning to send Christ in order to accomplish that very goal: the salvation of Jews and Gentiles.

Don’t get me wrong, there’s a lot about Paul’s writings that are complicated. I could easily be missing something. All I know is that the gospel won’t contradict itself.

Your IRS analogy makes a category error. The IRS is not omniscient, my Lord and Savior is.

There are no passages that tell us that GOD desires all men to be saved. When looked at within the context all passages used to support such a view will either lead one to hold to universal salvation or to the biblical understanding of salvation of God’s elect.

You know, it’s kind of like our tax law: those who are married are “predestined” to get one deduction; those who are single are “predestined” to get another. But we all know the IRS isn’t aware of who will or won’t fit into those groups.

Bottom line, I think that no matter how you look at it, the passages dealing with predestination are complicated. There are much plainer passages that tell us God wants us all to be saved, and Christ died for all men, that the gospel is for all, and that detail things God wants us to do to be pleasing to him.

I guess it’s like Geocreationist said, whether predestination really talks about individuals or not, if we “choose Jesus” we can’t go wrong.

Geocreationist, the verses I cited DO NOT speak of “certain kinds” of sinners.

And I agree that it’s not always easy to know how to look at some of those writings. Even Peter admitted that some of what Paul wrote was pretty difficult to understand.