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	<title>Comments on: The Bible says what?!</title>
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	<link>http://heissufficient.com/2008/03/03/the-bible-says-what/</link>
	<description>Searching for wit and wisdom in a wilderness of words...</description>
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		<title>By: Steve</title>
		<link>http://heissufficient.com/2008/03/03/the-bible-says-what/comment-page-1/#comment-1027</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Mar 2008 04:46:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heissufficient.wordpress.com/?p=590#comment-1027</guid>
		<description>Yeah, Mike, but you&#039;ll notice that Deut 14:26 didn&#039;t instruct anyone to get drunk, but to rejoice before the Lord - the two seem hardly compatible - whereas the remarkable thing about the Proverbs 31 passage is that it sounds like it is advocating getting wasted.

FWIW, I think there&#039;s something to Jim Swindle&#039;s explanation; it certainly appears, however, to segue from &quot;Drunkenness is beneath kings, but not beneath the hapless,&quot;  to &quot;In fact, as a king you should try to alleviate the pain of your suffering subjects however necessary,&quot; (vv. 8-9) with handouts of booze falling under that provision.  Interesting passage, that!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, Mike, but you&#8217;ll notice that Deut 14:26 didn&#8217;t instruct anyone to get drunk, but to rejoice before the Lord &#8211; the two seem hardly compatible &#8211; whereas the remarkable thing about the Proverbs 31 passage is that it sounds like it is advocating getting wasted.</p>
<p>FWIW, I think there&#8217;s something to Jim Swindle&#8217;s explanation; it certainly appears, however, to segue from &#8220;Drunkenness is beneath kings, but not beneath the hapless,&#8221;  to &#8220;In fact, as a king you should try to alleviate the pain of your suffering subjects however necessary,&#8221; (vv. 8-9) with handouts of booze falling under that provision.  Interesting passage, that!</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Beidler</title>
		<link>http://heissufficient.com/2008/03/03/the-bible-says-what/comment-page-1/#comment-1026</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Beidler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Mar 2008 19:13:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heissufficient.wordpress.com/?p=590#comment-1026</guid>
		<description>And the NET Bible uses &quot;beer,&quot; too.  Being my favorite translation, I&#039;ll go for &quot;beer&quot; as the most accurate translation.

Mmmm ... beer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And the NET Bible uses &#8220;beer,&#8221; too.  Being my favorite translation, I&#8217;ll go for &#8220;beer&#8221; as the most accurate translation.</p>
<p>Mmmm &#8230; beer.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike Beidler</title>
		<link>http://heissufficient.com/2008/03/03/the-bible-says-what/comment-page-1/#comment-1025</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike Beidler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 06 Mar 2008 19:11:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heissufficient.wordpress.com/?p=590#comment-1025</guid>
		<description>Deut 14:26 (ESV) states,

&quot;... and spend the money for whatever you desire—oxen or sheep or wine or &lt;b&gt;strong drink&lt;/b&gt;, whatever your appetite craves. And you shall eat there before the LORD your God and rejoice, you and your household.&quot;

The NASB, KJV, ASV, YLT uses &quot;strong drink.&quot;
The NKJV uses &quot;similar drink&quot; [to wine]
The Amplified uses &quot;strong[er] drink.&quot;
The NLT uses &quot;alcoholic drink.&quot;
The NIV uses &quot;fermented drink.&quot;
The Message, CEV, NCV, HCSB uses &quot;beer.&quot;

Mmmm ... beer. ;-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Deut 14:26 (ESV) states,</p>
<p>&#8220;&#8230; and spend the money for whatever you desire—oxen or sheep or wine or <b>strong drink</b>, whatever your appetite craves. And you shall eat there before the LORD your God and rejoice, you and your household.&#8221;</p>
<p>The NASB, KJV, ASV, YLT uses &#8220;strong drink.&#8221;<br />
The NKJV uses &#8220;similar drink&#8221; [to wine]<br />
The Amplified uses &#8220;strong[er] drink.&#8221;<br />
The NLT uses &#8220;alcoholic drink.&#8221;<br />
The NIV uses &#8220;fermented drink.&#8221;<br />
The Message, CEV, NCV, HCSB uses &#8220;beer.&#8221;</p>
<p>Mmmm &#8230; beer. <img src='http://heissufficient.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: James Pate</title>
		<link>http://heissufficient.com/2008/03/03/the-bible-says-what/comment-page-1/#comment-1024</link>
		<dc:creator>James Pate</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Mar 2008 22:33:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heissufficient.wordpress.com/?p=590#comment-1024</guid>
		<description>Hi ElShaddai.

Yeah, I once heard a pastor try to interpret this verse in a speech against drunkenness.  He said, &quot;Drinking will make you forget your problems, but it won&#039;t make them go away.  Plus, you&#039;ll have a hangover the next morning.&quot;  I thought he was adding his own stuff to the text there.

But I like what Jim Swindle said: Drinking is not for kings.  Leave it to the winos.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi ElShaddai.</p>
<p>Yeah, I once heard a pastor try to interpret this verse in a speech against drunkenness.  He said, &#8220;Drinking will make you forget your problems, but it won&#8217;t make them go away.  Plus, you&#8217;ll have a hangover the next morning.&#8221;  I thought he was adding his own stuff to the text there.</p>
<p>But I like what Jim Swindle said: Drinking is not for kings.  Leave it to the winos.</p>
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		<title>By: ElShaddai Edwards</title>
		<link>http://heissufficient.com/2008/03/03/the-bible-says-what/comment-page-1/#comment-1023</link>
		<dc:creator>ElShaddai Edwards</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Mar 2008 17:25:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heissufficient.wordpress.com/?p=590#comment-1023</guid>
		<description>You may be right, Jim. I was looking at the NEB last night and instead of &quot;Let them drink...&quot;, the translators chose something along the lines of &quot;Men such as these drink...&quot; To my ears, that better contrasts the royal reader with the embittered drunkards in drawing the distinction between their approach to life.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You may be right, Jim. I was looking at the NEB last night and instead of &#8220;Let them drink&#8230;&#8221;, the translators chose something along the lines of &#8220;Men such as these drink&#8230;&#8221; To my ears, that better contrasts the royal reader with the embittered drunkards in drawing the distinction between their approach to life.</p>
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		<title>By: Jim Swindle</title>
		<link>http://heissufficient.com/2008/03/03/the-bible-says-what/comment-page-1/#comment-1022</link>
		<dc:creator>Jim Swindle</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 05 Mar 2008 02:56:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heissufficient.wordpress.com/?p=590#comment-1022</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m wondering whether the verses aren&#039;t shaming the potentially royal reader; something like &quot;Drinking lots of alcohol isn&#039;t for you. Leave it to the winos, to those whose lives are bitter. Wine may help them forget their troubles, but you&#039;re called to something better.&quot;

Whether or not you&#039;d agree with my interpretation, the main question here doesn&#039;t appear to be what the verses say, but what they mean in context. As a result, our problem in understanding them is probably not the fault of our translations, but of our spiritual insensitivity. (I&#039;m not saying that anyone who disagrees with my interpretation is insensitive; just that all of us, including me, are still at least slightly warped by sin.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m wondering whether the verses aren&#8217;t shaming the potentially royal reader; something like &#8220;Drinking lots of alcohol isn&#8217;t for you. Leave it to the winos, to those whose lives are bitter. Wine may help them forget their troubles, but you&#8217;re called to something better.&#8221;</p>
<p>Whether or not you&#8217;d agree with my interpretation, the main question here doesn&#8217;t appear to be what the verses say, but what they mean in context. As a result, our problem in understanding them is probably not the fault of our translations, but of our spiritual insensitivity. (I&#8217;m not saying that anyone who disagrees with my interpretation is insensitive; just that all of us, including me, are still at least slightly warped by sin.)</p>
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		<title>By: ElShaddai Edwards</title>
		<link>http://heissufficient.com/2008/03/03/the-bible-says-what/comment-page-1/#comment-1021</link>
		<dc:creator>ElShaddai Edwards</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Mar 2008 18:36:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heissufficient.wordpress.com/?p=590#comment-1021</guid>
		<description>Yes, but do those verses explicitly condone finding emotional comfort in a bottle (or wineskin)? I get the physical comfort parallel in 1 Timothy, but it&#039;s not exactly the same...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, but do those verses explicitly condone finding emotional comfort in a bottle (or wineskin)? I get the physical comfort parallel in 1 Timothy, but it&#8217;s not exactly the same&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Peter Kirk</title>
		<link>http://heissufficient.com/2008/03/03/the-bible-says-what/comment-page-1/#comment-1020</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter Kirk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Mar 2008 18:16:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heissufficient.wordpress.com/?p=590#comment-1020</guid>
		<description>There are parallels in what you and I consider Scripture, even if JPS doesn&#039;t: John 2:9, 1 Timothy 5:23.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There are parallels in what you and I consider Scripture, even if JPS doesn&#8217;t: John 2:9, 1 Timothy 5:23.</p>
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		<title>By: ElShaddai Edwards</title>
		<link>http://heissufficient.com/2008/03/03/the-bible-says-what/comment-page-1/#comment-1019</link>
		<dc:creator>ElShaddai Edwards</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Mar 2008 14:30:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heissufficient.wordpress.com/?p=590#comment-1019</guid>
		<description>Thanks guys; that really helps explain this particular translation choice. Hopefully Suzanne will see this, as I don&#039;t think this angle was mentioned in &lt;a href=&quot;http://englishbibles.blogspot.com/2007/11/shaddai-sufficient.html&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;her discussion of &lt;em&gt;hikanos&lt;/em&gt;&lt;/a&gt; in the &quot;Shaddai&quot; series of posts.

It would be interesting to know if there was a tradition of &lt;em&gt;hikanos&lt;/em&gt; as a name of God prior to the LXX, or if this was an inspired choice by the translators (also appearing several times in Job - see the link to Suzanne&#039;s post in the previous paragraph).</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks guys; that really helps explain this particular translation choice. Hopefully Suzanne will see this, as I don&#8217;t think this angle was mentioned in <a  href="http://englishbibles.blogspot.com/2007/11/shaddai-sufficient.html" rel="nofollow">her discussion of <em>hikanos</em></a> in the &#8220;Shaddai&#8221; series of posts.</p>
<p>It would be interesting to know if there was a tradition of <em>hikanos</em> as a name of God prior to the LXX, or if this was an inspired choice by the translators (also appearing several times in Job &#8211; see the link to Suzanne&#8217;s post in the previous paragraph).</p>
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		<title>By: Esteban Vázquez</title>
		<link>http://heissufficient.com/2008/03/03/the-bible-says-what/comment-page-1/#comment-1018</link>
		<dc:creator>Esteban Vázquez</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Mar 2008 12:59:53 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Aww, shucks--Kurk Gayle stole my thunder! Anyway, what he said about wordplay in the LXX Ruth. :-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Aww, shucks&#8211;Kurk Gayle stole my thunder! Anyway, what he said about wordplay in the LXX Ruth. <img src='http://heissufficient.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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